April 4, 2020
Scaling to the Moon – Inside our $2 Million Dollar Ecommerce Case Study | AWasia 2017

Scaling to the Moon – Inside our $2 Million Dollar Ecommerce Case Study | AWasia 2017

What’s up AWA? I’m Steve Tan.
Hello everyone, I’m Evan Tan. How is everyone today? How is everyone today? Okay, alright. So this is my first time to Bangkok. I’m very excited and honoured to be here to share How we scale our 2 million dollar store, so we have a little bit of time
so I want to jump straight into a shot about us, about me and Evan and how we got started in this journey, okay? We’re not public speakers, so I’m actually very nervous right now with my brother, so please give us some support,
if we say some things, okay. Thank you so much. So I started my journey doing physical products since 2006 from eBay, the reason why I’ve been selling physical products is because I’ve been in based in China for the past 11 years. So having access to Taobao, Alibaba
makes much easier for me to get into physical products,
so since then I’ve been selling more than multiple 8 figures of physical
products until now. We have been selling it since 2006
on eBay and transitioned over to fully ecommerce on 2008. So since then I’ve been sharing a lot of our posts in my Ecommerce Elites group, if you guys are interested,
feel free join it. It’s a free group on Facebook and
we can just go to SteveTan.com and it will redirect to our Facebook group. So some of the records that we
have done personally about 2 million. This is back in April, so we have broke this record, but we have no time to update this screenshot. So we did about 3 million plus back in October for one of our big stores too, and this is our biggest day in one single store 360k,
but there’s several more smaller stores which we are doing right now to diversify, not everything in one store. So today I’m gonna share a little bit more
on how we scale horizontally and what we mean
by scaling vertically. Scaling horizontally, so a lot of people have been asking me some questions regarding Why are you able to scale one store
to such big numbers? So there’s actually a few ways that we can do, So we combine a few of this together so that we can achieve bigger numbers. So you can either have one big product
which a lot of a lot of ecommerce players are doing right now,
or you could have 50 2k products, what I mean is
that you should actually diversify more instead of focusing
everything on just one product, when someone comes to me
and tells me Steve, I’m doing 50k per day,
I’m doing big numbers, I say good, how many products do you have?
If he says, I only have one product the first thing I will tell them is,
you do not have a business because what if the product dies down,
it dies in the natural product trend, you do not have a business the next day.
For me personally, of course we like to have a lot of
1st tier products but we also have a lot of 2nd tier,
like 2k products. We also have a lot of 1k products, which I’ll say more about
in the third tier. So you need to have a lot of products in order to diversify your risk, and to have so much products.
You need to have a system in place. If you do not have a system in place
like researching methods for a team This is very hard for you
to scale efficiently. So Evan will touch base on how we do research and a few of the common sites and the common tools
that we’re gonna use. So also, when you find one,
single product that you can do you’re gonna scale it hard, okay.
Because if you do not scale it fast enough, everyone is gonna know. This market is very transparent,
so everyone’s gonna use the same ad copy,
use the same product, everyone has access to AliExpress,
so that is why you need to learn how to scale efficiently on Facebook. We’re gonna go through
the best practices that we use what kind of ad copies,
when to cut and scale your ads later on and re-targeting
and lookalike audiences as well. And also the differences between auto
and manual bids, and why we prefer the one over the other one. So are you guys ready? Alright, awesome! Evan?
Alright. Wait so first thing, just now as Steven said
how do we actually scale horizontally? In order to really look for a lot of products
out there in the market you actually need to really go deep. So we really have to go through
the usual few. A lot of people, when they always ask me,
hey Steve and Evan, how do you look for the few products? They always talk about the usual few.
Instead, me and Steve we actually have our secret weapon and
also at the end of everything we actually create a process so
that all this process is automated. So the first few or the usual few,
asks everyone, where do I go search for products? It’s always that people go to the top sellers
Amazon, AliExpress or Wish All these are the very, very common websites where people just go look for
the top sellers and go through the categories. This is the most common one
where you can actually go. Yes, it still works, but considering the
market is getting more and more competitive and products are getting more
and more saturated, it’s actually harder to find
a product there nowadays. So what we actually do,
me and Steve, being in China for such a long period of time
we actually have our own secret weapon and that is actually Taobao. Some of you guys, if you have been in
China or actually have been shopping online a lot, probably you have heard of Taobao before. So there’s actually a saying
if you can’t find something on Taobao you probably can’t find it anywhere else. Actually the person who says this
is me, myself. So actually why I actually say
this is because being in China for so many years,
I actually buy a lot of stuff on Taobao. So a lot of things you can find on Taobao. You actually don’t see it on Amazon.com So the ridiculous thing is you can find ridiculous things on Taobao.com Look at what you can find on Taobao. You can even buy worms. They even have a money-back guarantee to buy worms, living cockroaches,
you can buy all sorts of things. Of course, I’m not saying you are selling
cockroaches on ecommerce right, but there are tons of categories
out there in Taobao. A lot of the things that’s not being developed yet in the United States, you can find it in Taobao,
so for a quick run-through of the research process, have your staff or go through Toabao
yourself, if you can’t read Chinese, Just translate it and go through all of it and I’m sure you find real killer products,
you can actually find a lot of products that are going to sell really well in ecommerce. So as you can see the picture right here there’s tons and tons of categories
we can find. So at the end of it by creating a team
we create a process. What are the wow factor of these products, you ask yourself, if you are the customer why is this product a wow factor or does it actually have a wow factor. Try selling and persuading yourself before,
so after you know all of these factors, create an excel sheet for your staff,
your research team let them go through Taobao for you
because it’s very very time consuming to actually go through all this everyday.
So at the end of it, vet it personally, go through the excel sheet of what your staff has done and actually go through it and sooner or later You’ll be able to find a lot of really good, 1st tier products, 2nd tier products and 3rd tier products. So this is how me and Steve, we are able to build our ecommerce as a real business. It’s not just one product where we scale really hard and maybe one month later we are closed for business. That’s not how ecommerce works
so by setting a process out properly, You are able to sustain this ecommerce business for a long period of time, alright. So right now I’ll let Steve talk about
how to scale vertically with Facebook Ads. Okay so, I’m gonna share a little bit
of our best practices and some of the things that
we’re gonna go through here. So the first thing is
we use a lot and a lot of emojis, I’m sure a lot of you here
are familiar of this but we try not to overdo it
in a way that it becomes spammy, but do it more in a natural way
because we find it Increases the click-through rate a lot,
of course when all of you guys start using it the performance might decrease,
so try to be a little bit creative with different kinds of upcoming holidays,
Christmas and so on and so forth It really helps us build up on our
click-through rates. So here are some quick examples I’m sure you guys see a lot of them on Facebook or spy tools, check it out. See how people are doing it How hard all those good ads are
doing and how they are maintaining, scaling really, really huge video views
or conversions, okay? So we also use customised thumbnails
for all our videos, you shouldn’t just go and upload
a video and just pull a random thumbnail that you think is gonna work well.
Always try to split test, what kind of time nails would actually
increase your click-through rates. So for us, we usually have like 5 to 6
different thumbnails per video so that we can keep testing and split testing
which ones have the best optimal conversions or click-through rates
or CPA so on and so forth. Because not everyone autoplays
and it captures attention with unique thumbnail. You can add in different kind of
wordings with your thumbnail or you can
add in some emojis I’m sure a lot of viral videos,
the funny ones that you see on YouTube or the ones that you see on Facebook usually do have very customised
video thumbnails. So eye-catching video,
always make sure you can put in some tag lines, like tag someone who needs this, turn on the sound or
you would love this. Usually last time, before we started using this,
we used it a lot on the ad copy, but we find it performs way better if we put it inside the thumbnail
itself where people, when they see the ad they don’t even have to read your ad copy, because nowadays people just skim through all the ads kind of becoming blind to it in a way. So you want to make sure
you put in a lot of effort into making sure that people seized it in
the first split second. Alright, so now w are in Q4 right,
CPMs are outrageously high. So you have to make sure you have
very good click-through rates, good engagement.
So usually we will run a little bit of PPE ads, page post engagement to kind of
get a feel to how this ad is actually performing or engaging with the crowd
or the viewers. So make sure you
have all these emojis, customised thumbnails to make sure
that you have better click-through rates and it will reduce your CPM a little it
or it will make sure that you can actually scale
bigger with more clicks. So we’re also gonna touch base
on how we do re-targeting, So we do a lot of VC, initial check out
but no purchase, and also we do a lot of
customised post to re-engage our customers I’m sure a lot of you here know what is re-targeting,
but we do pretty much every single option that’s available on Facebook for making sure that we can reach all our custom audiences. Last time, we avoided a lot of
initial check out because we thought since we’re already doing add to cart,
why should we do initial check-out? It actually surprised us, one of our
best performing ad sets actually came from initial check out. Yo you make sure you segment
your audience properly so that you can create a lot of re-targeting
and use for lookalike audiences as well. We use a lot of lookalike audiences
which kind of accounts for pretty much 50 to 60% of all our sales. So if you’re talking about our sales,
it’s at least I would say at least seven figures
coming from lookalike audiences itself. The only downside to
lookalike audiences is sometimes it might be a little bit cranky,
it might not have delivery, but if you contact Facebook,
they’ll tell you okay it’s overlap or something. I kind of feel, if you leave it there for a few
days, sometimes it will just re-optimise itself and give you delivery, but if you don’t get
any delivery just delete that ad set or that campaign and recreate it again. Alright, so the lifetime value,
this is something that’s pretty much added just a few months ago, and this
actually works a lot of wonders for us. So you can basically export everything from
Shopify or some way, your email list That has all this value and put it up.
So basically what it does is it combines all the information of your
top end customers. Facebook will automatically find all the
best, high-value customers for you based on your ROAS and based
on the order value. We also do a lot,
we do everything above 50%. I haven’t tried anything below 15
because if someone is not Interested in watching to finish your video, most probably they are not interested in buying a product as well.
So do test everything above 50% all the way to 95% for your
lookalike audiences as well. We also target top-tier countries like
US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand but usually we’ll try to group them
as well, so we can segment them by APEC, EEA, ASEAN and NAFTA. Looklike audiences. There’s a few ways to do this. You know 1 to 10%. I have never gone above 10%
with some special tools but I think 10% is pretty much
the max you can do. So usually there’s a few ways that I do this,
either I do 1%-2%, 2-3, 3-4 or sometimes I’ll just segment them to 0-5, 5-10,
or you can just play around with it. The best one I have is
actually around 3-5%. Not necessarily that your 5%
is going to outdo your 10%. It doesn’t mean that 0-1%
is always the best performing one. It doesn’t work like this. So you have
to make sure you test. Sometimes, you get way better results with 8-10%,
sometimes you get better result at 3%. There’s no guarantee. I wish I could tell you 1%
works the best, but the matter of truth is,
Facebook doesn’t work that way. We use auto-bid on
70% of all our campaigns because it’s very time saving to use
auto-bid. If you are using some manual bids, unless you’re using some tools like Smartly
or some some other tools, It will usually take you a lot of time to
optimise your manual campaigns. So we only use it for 20-30%
of all our ads because if you find a killer product,
we will usually create a very, very big manual campaign. Usually in the
range of 50,000 to 25,000 per ad set that is how we scale with manual bidding. But sometimes when my friends ask me, Are you doing a lot of manual bidding?
And ask, what’s your budget? If you are spending less than like one
to two hundred a few hundred per day on that ad set I wouldn’t suggest even trying out
manual bidding because it doesn’t work very effectively. There is no fixed way, but we use a lot.
We only use auto bids for testing products. I wouldn’t even use manual bidding for testing new products because it’s so time-consuming, And we test so many different products
day in and day out. No fixed way of testing, so be flexible
and be creative in testing, similar to how you guys do CPA. I kind of felt that you guys are way ahead of the curve
with CPA, that is why a lot of my friends who is are doing very well in ecommerce
usually have a very strong background in CPA. So you guys are actually crushing it a lot
because with all the experience, with all the creativity and that you guys do,
you guys can crush it easily and you have way more advantage
than normal marketers. So be creative in your testing. So this is the initial way we do testing,
it’s very common. It’s one campaign per country,
20 ad sets usually per new product. We split it by interests.
Usually 500k and above audience size, this is how we do our testing. If you have a big group of custom audience,
you can use that for testing as well and we do one-day click. Okay, so for auto-bid. Oh, I’m running out of time,
so I have to be fast here, okay. This is all the information here. We usually scale when it has at least 2-3x ROI
because once you start scaling, your CPA is gonna go up. Your ROI is
gonna go down, right. So make sure you have
at least good, ROAS before you start scaling because if you don’t, you’re gonna see like,
once you have 2x/3x once you scale, probably you will go down in negative. Okay, so scale with auto and duplicate manual.
If you have very good performing auto campaigns, auto ad sets, duplicate it and do manual
and you can actually scale pretty quickly with big budgets,
but make sure you have very good ROAS before you consider duplicating
it to do manual. Okay, alright so when to cut? Okay, I’ll just display everything. So, do not optimise your ads like on day 1 or day 2.
Try to at least give it at least 3-7 days. If you give it enough time and you can cut your ads, most likely you’re gonna see very inconsistent results. So we usually have 2-3 screens, big screens, if you guys are doing this as a full-time job make sure you have big monitors,
whereby you can split the screens you can have 3 days here, 7 days here
and compare the metrics easily. Don’t start optimising your ads just like
one day in you see good results or you see bad results you start killing the budget or turning
off the ad set, it doesn’t work that way. Give it a little bit more time. Now we stick to at least 7 days
even if we are in the red, negative ROI, We’re still gonna give it a little bit more time in testing.
Facebook recommends 2 weeks but I think it’s kind of too long,
so I’ll stick to seven days. We also use a lot of Facebook rules,
we don’t use the paid media buy tools like Smartly because I feel
it’s kind of a little bit expensive for us. So we felt it’s more efficient if I hire a little bit more manpower for our media buyers. So we use a lot of Facebook automation tools,
which I think some of the speakers have really touched base on. So it automates a lot of things while you’re away,
like even if we’re on events or away on holidays, it does a lot of work. It’s very straightforward. You can adjust your cost per purchase,
you can also adjust like a lot of things like increase the budget by 20% per day well, if it’s
performing. If not, you can turn it off. Alright, so that’s all that I’m gonna share.
I hope you guys, you know, due to time constraints I cannot expand all my information
on how we deal with our company operations, how we do our full research,
usually we’ll have different kinds of Operations for an entirely different company structure. So I hope you guys can scale to the moon and I’ll see you guys up there. Thank you so much.
Alright, thank you. Thanks guys. Hey Eric. That was fantastic.
Are you ready for a few questions? Yeah, sure. Yeah, so we’ve got the Tan Brothers on stage, so come on up to the microphones here. We’ve got some nice chairs. You guys sit over there.
I’ll sit over here. So they just said they’re like, we normally like to talk about all these other things but we don’t have time,
but now there’s time. So now you can ask them
any of these type of questions. But wow, I just want to know,
what’s your personal favourite emoji? I think my personal, favourite emoji
is probably the heart eyes, you know, the eyes. I saw that in there, yeah. That’s the one that probably resonates with the customer the most. The most emotional, right? Yeah.
Because it’s that happy love feeling. Yeah, and of course for Christmas,
you have the Christmas trees so before the customer even
looks at the video itself, he knows that this is related to Christmas.
So it will enable like the customer to stop and actually look look at the ad copy itself.
Yeah, you got one? We kind of split test a few but for me.
I don’t have personal favourite. I only care if it’s ROI. Yeah.
So it’s good ROI, it’s my personal favourite. Yeah nice. I got to use
an emo the other day, a T-bone steak for the first time,
I was describing James van Elswyk. So I just put the t-bone steak and I was
happy about that. I don’t know if it worked,
but it was fun. Okay, we got a question here. Hello guys, it was really nice
presentation, very informative. I’d like to ask you about “scare
or shitty opens” marketing How often do you use it to
sell products to your audience? Do you scare them or you
make them feel better before they come to your web page
or before they make decision to buy? Can you repeat that? How often do you use scare
or shitty opens marketing? Like fear-based marketing versus
love based marketing. Oh, you mean scarcity? I I actually remove everything with scarcity
because too much people are using it and It’s kind of like, if you split test it with the performance on the time and conversion rate, it doesn’t affect too much, it actually went
up for us, but do make sure you test. Actually I like websites that load really quickly,
so, we removed it and the time actually went down,
so if you have all these apps in place, It’s going to add a lot of time to your conversion, I mean your website. I will detailise my question.
For example, in case of dog collars, some people promoted like 6,000,000
dogs being killed on the roads every year. And other people promoted that this collar
would look really nice on your dog. What would you suggest?
Scare them or? Fear-based, right?
So like, your dog is gonna die. I personally don’t like to use that,
I mean, I do see some people using it, I’m not sure how well it converts or performs
but I mean, if you’re building a sustainable long-term brand,
I would suggest you stay away from it but if it’s kind of like, a small storage that
is just gonna last for like 5-6 months, feel free to use that if it increases
your performance or ROI. And you mentioned about motivation timers?
So you have only 10 minutes to buy? Yeah, I removed that, I removed that because I feel
this is a little bit scammy and it’s it’s fake. How about discounts?
Like when you re-market, do you ever use discounts where you re-marketed to someone, you say okay, now it’s 15% off. Do you play around with that?
Yeah. I re-target the crap out of them until they buy.
Yeah. And do you scale the price down? Yeah, we do. We try with 5% then after
if they don’t buy, we increase it to 10% up to the maximum that
we are comfortable with. Oh cool. Nice. Within your margin. Anyone else out there?
Oh right here? Hey guys great presentation.
I want to ask you. What’s your input on branding product and fulfilling them
directly, instead of dropshipping. Sorry, I can’t really hear.
You gotta really get closer to the mic. I’d like to ask, what is your input on branding product and fulfilling them instead of dropshipping them? Fulfilment time, is it? Yeah, alright.
If you fulfil from the US obviously, it’s gonna be way faster,
which if you want to go the branding route you could send your stock
to like a 3PL company in the US Or you can send it to Amazon,
fulfilled by Amazon, Or I would suggest if you’re just starting out,
do dropshipping all the way from China, but if you’re gonna do a sustainable long brand,
probably you have to do it in the US and eventually you’re gonna have
regional warehouses all over. The main few ones would be Europe, US and Asia.
So we have a warehouse in Hong Kong as well that’s takes care the APEC region
and from China takes care of the other countries, sometimes US and sometimes in the US
we do have local US warehouses if that product is very popular, but
you have to make sure that product is something that’s gonna be
trending for a long time. So one of the mistakes that we did, it was like it kind of scaled pretty quickly,
but eventually it kind of died. But we have like over 100,000
stock in the US because no one’s buying after the whole trend dies.
So you have to be a little bit more careful with stocking a lot of inventory if
you’re branding your own product. Nice.
Thank you. We have a celebrity question here
from SheCommerce founder, Mirella. Okay, so you guys talked about how you
let Facebook do a lot of the automation for you, but with using the rules and everything
with regards to ad placement, Do you use automatic placements
or do you isolate them in assets to re-target them, say mobile and desktop later,
and vice versa. How do you deal with ad placements? Alright, for our ad placement, normally we
tend to split test a lot of them. We tend to actually mostly use mobile and desktop feeds and we split test them with another one
with the audience network that Facebook has, and we actually split everything as well
on Instagram. So actually, by splitting off this is very clear that we are able to see
which ad set performs the best. Well usually, you get like lower CPMs
if you don’t split them, so Facebook actually kind of recommends
that we put in all placements, but we kind of have better performers
if we split them up. Nice. So you guys have expanded.
How big is your team now, total? 60 plus. 60 plus?
Yeah. And that’s over in multiple regions or? Yeah.
Almost 100% virtual. Only in the Philippines and in China, as well.
Cool. So who do you consider or what position, let’s say, do you consider sort of the most essential to your business, other than you two? Project manager and right-hand man. We define it as project manager or product
manager, it’s kind of the same role. Yeah. So in startups, the product manager
has a lot of authority in the company, this dictates where the company’s going.
So we kind of use it as a little bit like, so in our company we call it as the project manager
that actually manages the whole thing and he has a few managers under him
and they report, too. Yeah. So this guy only reports
directly to us, no one else. And how did you go about finding that person then? Did you meet them in person?
Did you go to an Upwork-type site? Cause if there’s such a key person, how did
you make sure they were right? You have to pay a lot for these kinds
of people, obviously, right. If you pay crap, you get crap in return,
right. So this guy actually worked for one of my startups before,
so I kind of knew his personality. He’s a hustler.
He has to work. If you’re gonna find someone random,
I wouldn’t hire someone that’s like super top-tier, executive level because
he’s not the guy that actually does all the execution You need a grinder. Yeah.
So you need someone that’s kind of like one level below the executive
so that he can do all this execution work for you. Yeah, that makes sense.
I think we’ve got a question here. I just wanted to know how many products are you testing on a weekly basis? So on a daily on a daily basis, we tend to
test at least 10 products. So all this process has been
automated by our team. So what we do, as we mentioned just now,
we set out a process from the research team. So, let’s say our product team, the research team searched at least 30-40 products every single day and we have our right-hand man
who vets through all of the products and then let’s say 10 products each day,
you set a date for each green light, you give a green light for them
to launch it the next day, or the day after and then our media buying
team will take over from there, and then video editing,
there will be video editing. Editing the videos, the photos,
the thumbnails and then it will be handed over to the media buying team, where they do get also copy-writing done for them and then
straightaway start doing the ads split test. So some of our media buyers, we actually
fly them over to us, we train them personally so they actually know a lot of
the strategies that we use. They would be in charge of actually
doing most of the media buying and then after that, for the final scaling
where it’s really scaling, let’s say we find a really, really good product, then I actually come over and actually personally handle the large products we’re scaling above
100,000 a day, yeah. And so, at what point, I mean essentially
when you’re scaling the product, do you actually ship it to yourself to start
doing all the marketing assets, so you’re not using it from AliExpress or whatnot, the imagery?
At what point do you determine when is a good time to actually ship it to yourself? Alright, so at the start, we always, it’s still a dropshipping business,
but at a large scale like what we’re doing right now,
we have our own warehouse in China, so actually what we feel is a good practice
is after 2 days or 3 days, if it’s starting to sell above 100 pieces a day,
we will start like buying in bulk. Buying maybe, like let’s
say we’re selling 500 a day we’ll buy around 700 a day, so everything
will be shipped to our logistics partner in China. So it’s like more of a lean approach. We would rather, because of what Steve mentioned, we had a mistake where we
overstock too much. So we actually just over stock by a little bit,
where you’re guaranteed to sell it the next day. Overstock by a little bit, where you’re guaranteed to sell it the next day. Thank you.
Thank you. Just specifically though,
for people starting out in ecommerce, how important it is it to actually
get your hands on the product, physically before you start selling it? So that
you could potentially make assets about it. That’s a very tough question because
there’s different ways of actually doing the business right, some people
prefer to see and feel the product, some people only care about ROI,
some people only care about making money. So it really boils down to the entrepreneur himself,
if he cares a lot about the customer definitely he will go through it. He will want to make sure that
he sees the product, feel for it, if the product is good quality. So, for us because we have a team in China,
so it makes it much easier for us to buy samples and you can get away with
having a physical presence and can request samples
from these big suppliers. Because you come in? Yeah.
And you can say we’re looking to buy 10,000 units, can you give us some samples?
You usually will get it for free, so use the free ones and sell it through
dropshipping and you get the ball rolling. Nice. Very cool. We got a question over here. Hi guys, thanks for the presentations, very good.
Thank you. I got a question. I live in China, so I know
how powerful Taobao is, but my question is compared to
Aliexpress, where most of the stores in AliExpress is pretty much equipped to shipments nationally, but as we all know, Taobao is pretty much like a local business type of app or store or you know. So in terms of finding a product or after
you found a product that you think it’s gonna work from Taobao, how do you handle
the shipping? Do we talk to the supplier? Do they have options for you?
So actually, you can, or well for us we have our own warehouse and logistics,
so instead of setting up something for yourself, there’s a lot of 3PL’s fulfillment of logistics companies
that you can work with, so once you test the product, it works well,
you can ship it in bulk to this fulfillment company who takes care of
everything for yoy. So something like an FBA-kind of set up but in China. So you send all orders
to them every single day and they’ll take care of all shipping for you. So the supplier doesn’t handle this shipping ? No. So everything that we do is all coming
out from our own warehouse. We do it for more control and more privacy
kind of approach because with sufficient cash bribe in China, you get a lot of unwanted information that you don’t want your competitors to know. So we kind of have everything
in-house for our logistics and our procurement so that we don’t
get unwanted information out as well and also if you ship everything in-house
you get very, very good shipping rates and you get first tier, ePacket rates as well. I think that’s after your business is
pretty much settled or? Yeah, I mean initially if you’re starting out. Sorry, what about in the very initial phase after you target, like after you found a product, and it’s joined the testing phase? If you’re just starting out probably you can
just talk to your Taobao supplier because they do have access to all of it.
It’s just a matter of whether they want or don’t want your business or is it
a lot of hassle for them to do it for you. But I’m sure you can easily find a lot of
fulfilment company’s in China that’s willing to help you get started with all this. So once you find this product well, you can order on Taobao and have it
shipped to the fulfilment company, and they’ll take care of shipping for you.
Okay thank you so much. Also another thing like I would like to
add on, we mostly use Taobao as a reference point because a lot of things there’s actually available on Taobao is not listed on Aliexpress yet. So actually by doing so, we use actually mostly as a reference point on Taobao, and then we actually have our own procurement team,
so at the same time you find a lot of agents or you know trading companies at Aliexpress. So you are able to actually go to Aliexpress,
send him the Taobao link and say, hey I want this to be dropshipped.
So normally, they will get it handled for you so this is when it’s starting out for beginners,
this is how you do it. Thank you very much. How do you handle a customer service and returns? Customer service?
And returns. So for customer service, we have a full fledged team in in the Philippines of at least 20 to 30 for customer service,
replying every day. We also have a 24/7 a live chat service, where a lot of customers always send in requests or to ask about refunds, returns. For returns is as simple as that, when a customer received it,
if he is able to provide proof that the item is spoiled, destroyed or he didn’t receive it,
the tracking shows it actually got lost then we will actually just send him
a new one, we will talk to him. Communication is really important here.
We actually communicate with the customer and ask him, do you want a
replacement? If he is willing to accept a replacement,
we just ship him a new one If he’s unwilling, then we give him the refund. But for returns we usually just tell them
to ship it back to China and I know it’s not the best, exact customer service that you want but most of the time, they’ll just think it’s a hassle and if they really want to ship it, it’s fine,
we just refund them the full amount. Nice. Another one over here.
Yeah, so thanks for the great talk. So during the initial research phase,
when you are testing out new niches, when do you decide that it’s time that
this particular niche is not working out? How much do you usually spend on Facebook
or give it like a number of days before deciding that this is something that
you don’t want to pursue further? So, actually like Steve has mentioned just now,
we actually have general stores, where you just throw everything in there
to test it. So normally, when we really decide to turn it off is after doing all of our testing methods. One is the interest targeting that we touched based on just now.
We actually have other testing methods as well. So after, if we use all our strategies and test it with different copies, different video, different thumbnails,
and it still doesn’t work. Like it’s negative, or not profitable at the end of the day,
after like 3 days or 7 days then we decide that this product doesn’t
work and we move on to the next product. Do you actually take them off your store?
Or do you stop promoting? No, we just stop promoting.
We still put it here. It’s free money, right. There’s no shelf space you’re taking
up in the digital environment. We used to have a lot of products.
Someone just comes to the store and he actually sees one item that he likes
and he just adds on to your AOV. He just goes, hey I like this as well.
He just adds it to the cart. Yeah, so it’s just free money. Just leave it on the store,
but just stop promotion for that. Okay, thanks. Do we have someone else maneuvering
up here for a question? First of all, thank you for the presentation.
Really speak up. So you have talked a little bit about
how to hire a manager, I would like to know more about how to hire
a media buying team. I guess a lot of business owners here
are afraid of giving up that part because they think that this is a very sensitive
part of their business, so they like to handle it on thier own. So I would like to know
more about this matter please. I usually prefer to hire someone
with just basic media buying knowledge because those that have really
good media buying skills, they cause a bomb and usually,
there’s very good reasons why they left their company to join you, right. So usually we will try to find someone with kind of basic Google Ads,
they have some internet marketing knowledge. We’ll usually hire them and
guide them through step by step. So initially, these people that come into the
company will be guided by a senior media buyer. So you’ll start with like very small
budgets, doing small things, like testing, research, interest research so and so forth
then slowly you guide them up step by step. It’s all about the skill that you want to
do. I kind of like travelling a lot, and also travelling across the world. I still like my lifestyle. I like to hands-free my business. I haven’t checked my ads for a long time. I prefer to set up a team with more
automation that can do all this stuff for you. So if you kind of prefer small team, in-house.
Then probably you can like just have one one person helping you, but if you
want more or hands-free Then you have to have people, because if
you don’t share, you can’t scale right. So Google or Facebook can’t get to where they are
today if they don’t share their inside stuff between their own teams right. Probably the question for you,
is if you have a virtual team then probably how you can structured it in a way whereby all the media buyers kind of
don’t know each other, so they kind of can exchange information.
Usually I don’t like one person that knows every single, inside out for your business,
because like if they can do that right they can do it for themselves and they can
actually use your company for testing products and when they find the hot selling products,
they can just do it at their own Shopify store at night. So that’s what kind of happened to one of my friends and in China, because he’s just starting out, he doesn’t have a lot of business sense,
but he’s doing like 10-20,000 per day. When I was talking to him, he showed me
his business model and I said, dude trust me, these two guys that you have
right now, they will leave your company within and I’m right, they are gone. They are using the company for
testing all these products. So find a little bit more time in structuring
your company in a way that if you don’t like sharing all this information,
so that if one person leaves everything is still intact.
Compartmentalisation. Yes. That makes sense.
So even for our website, website A customer support doesn’t know
website B customer support, so and so forth. So in the event like if they want to
do some funny tricks to us, they don’t have all this, because almost
everyone is hiring from the same location, Upwork or whichever, onlinejobs.ph. So sometimes when someone leaves, we will ask okay, which store did you manage or who did you work for
and easily a lot of information just comes out naturally. So try to be a bit more sensitive about all
this information. Thank you. Yeah, we got someone waiting here. Okay. Thank you for your presentation and this is our first year in ecommerce,
and we have a website and we only accept Paypal payment
and I find that, the order increases and there comes the fraud payments,
like unauthorised payments and so here’s my question, we don’t have a freely mocking a message yet So we wonder why and we’d like to know
how to deal with this kind of payment that have any kind of this issue? For us. It’s very simple, if it’s high risk from Stripe or inside Shopify dashboard. It shows you if it’s high. If it’s as high risk, we’ll just refund it.
Last time, we used to ask for more information but usually if you want more information,
you have to ask for their ID, Government ID front and back,
credit card cover the centre, 10 digits or whichever digits then ask
them to send it over back to you, but if you’re dealing with very high level scammers, then like they have all this information with them anyway. So far our team right now, we’ll just refund
all the high-risk orders and especially there’s a few countries that we don’t ship to. I don’t know where, like Vietnam, Indonesia,
those very high fraud countries. You can just Google high fraud countries,
and it’s there. So do you mean your practice is just to ask
them for the full information to attach it on people in dispute interface
and then you just refund them? PayPal is very good at helping you with protection so if you provide all the shipping information, they usually have you covered. But we heard that even if you refund
the payment, Paypal will also count this order into your rates
and once the rate is raised to let’s say 1% you face some risk in your payment account, this right?
That’s part of the business, you have to deal with it there’s nothing or no way around it, there’s no magic solution. Okay. Thank you. Okay guys, I think that’s it
our time is up, unfortunately. You’re gonna have to find them after
or you’re gonna, well I guess we’re out of tickets for Facebook Mastery Live, but make sure you grab the livestream for Facebook Mastery Live, the recordings and we still have day passes for day 1 of the Facebook Elite Retreat the Tan brothers are going to be giving away some
amazing value there, so go find myself at the booth or someone
at the iStack training booth and we can hook you up with
our day passes to the elite retreat. Let’s give the Tan brothers a big round of
applause, that was amazing.

13 thoughts on “Scaling to the Moon – Inside our $2 Million Dollar Ecommerce Case Study | AWasia 2017

  1. 20:39 'For me i don't have a personal favorite, i only care if its ROI, so if its good ROI, its my personal Favorite.' MY WORDS. Forreal

  2. Yikes brother! $360k in 1 day? Most we have ever done is $25k … you scaled hard man! Would love to get to those numbers, we will get there.. would love to meet you guys and or even pay for mentorship to get our stores to that level!

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